Upcoming Games


Full list
Add a game

Upcoming Events

No events to display

We are not planning any more in-person events until the COVID-19 situation has improved.

Where was I in July 2021?

You are here: Home > Forum > Miscellaneous > The real thing (anything else rail-oriented) > Where was I in July 2021?

Page 3 of 3

Where was I in July 2021? 28/11/2021 at 07:38 #142539
Humorist
Avatar
101 posts
Clive - good to read your trip log.

You mention your unexpected trip over the Edinburgh Sub. I assume this is a route knowledge run in the late evening, by Cross-Country. I think that CC tries to keep some of its drivers "route-learned" on the Sub, while ScotRail does not. Most of the time this doesn't matter, and didn't until a ScR train spread the track in West Princes Street Gardens some years ago. The ScR services had to be piloted by freight drivers, while CC were able to run most of theirs.

I assume that a "basher" like you is aware of PSUL (Passenger Services over Unusual Lines). 1C99 that you took is listed there.

Log in to reply
Where was I in July 2021? 28/11/2021 at 08:40 #142540
clive
Avatar
2463 posts
postal in post 142536 said:

just a question about the train round the Suburban Lines at Edinburgh. Would that routing be a way to maintain route knowledge for a potential diversionary route (perhaps from a link that would not be involved with the ECS workings routed in each direction round those lines)?
I've just looked at what Realtime Trains has to say for tomorrow.

There are 47 workings shown, the vast majority of which are goods trains presumably avoiding Waverley. Of the rest:
5T60 SR Haymarket Depot to Waverley (19), becomes 2T60 to Tweedbank
5M52 VT Polmadie Depot to Waverley (8), becomes 9M52 to Euston via Haymarket
5A06 XC Craigentinny to Dundee, becomes ...
5A07 XC Dundee to Craigentinny
0L05 GR Craigentinny to Perth, becomes ...
0L06 GR Perth to Craigentinny
1C99 XC Glasgow Central to Waverley (10), becomes 5C99 to Craigentinny
5S93 VT Waverley (9) to Polmadie Depot, was 9S93 from Euston via Haymarket

The two "becomes" are based on platform numbers. Presumably there could be shunting moves not timetabled to make use of the path (e.g. a loco swap at Perth).

Log in to reply
Where was I in July 2021? 28/11/2021 at 19:06 #142575
bill_gensheet
Avatar
859 posts
Indeed route knowledge, although as you say more of the XC route knowledge trasins are now ECS.
It uses Edinburgh P10 which is a through line.

As for the other question Clive raised...
"any other routes where passenger trains have non-station stops just to change token?"

Does that include RETB tokens ?
I have stopped at Gortan once (track inspection wanted the token Bridge of Orchy - Gortan so did not use the usual long section to Rannoch).
Glen Douglas is also used.
Keith Jn is remote from Keith (or has that gone now ?)

Also the stops approaching the junctions at Dingwall (Fodderty / Evanton) and Crianlarich (Lower Jn / Fillan) are common.

Bill

Log in to reply
Where was I in July 2021? 28/11/2021 at 20:20 #142583
Steamer
Avatar
3685 posts
bill_gensheet in post 142575 said:
Indeed route knowledge, although as you say more of the XC route knowledge trasins are now ECS.
It uses Edinburgh P10 which is a through line.

As for the other question Clive raised...
"any other routes where passenger trains have non-station stops just to change token?"

Does that include RETB tokens ?
I have stopped at Gortan once (track inspection wanted the token Bridge of Orchy - Gortan so did not use the usual long section to Rannoch).
Glen Douglas is also used.
Keith Jn is remote from Keith (or has that gone now ?)

Also the stops approaching the junctions at Dingwall (Fodderty / Evanton) and Crianlarich (Lower Jn / Fillan) are common.

Bill
There are a few others. Trains stop briefly at Midge Hall signal box to pick up the single line token to Rufford. This one is even stranger as there's no passing loop; the line from Farrington Curve Jn to Midge Hall was singled later than the rest of the route but the token arrangements were retained, so there's a transition from TCB to Token Working in the middle of a single line.

As tokens aren't exchanged on the move anymore, any loop where the box isn't on the platform will need a stop- trains to Maesteg stop at Tondu, then move up about 100m and stop at the box. I think Sellafield takes the record for this; even though the box is at the far end of the platform, trains still perform a double stop.

As Bill mentioned, there are remote RETB exchange points. On the Far North, these are at Clunes (breaking up the Inverness- Muir of Ord section), Evanton/Foderty (to allow trains to converge on the junction at Dingwall), Halkirk/Bower (converging on Georgemas Jn). The West Highland has Glen Douglas (passing loop and sidings), and Fillan/Lower Crianlarich (converging on Crianlarich).

"Don't stress/ relax/ let life roll off your backs./ Except for death and paying taxes/ everything in life.../ is only for now." (Avenue Q)
Log in to reply
Where was I in July 2021? 29/11/2021 at 20:13 #142609
clive
Avatar
2463 posts
bill_gensheet in post 142575 said:

As for the other question Clive raised...
"any other routes where passenger trains have non-station stops just to change token?"

Does that include RETB tokens ?
Not in my opinion, unless it was a token point before the days of RETB.

Log in to reply
Where was I in July 2021? 29/11/2021 at 20:24 #142611
clive
Avatar
2463 posts
Steamer in post 142583 said:
bill_gensheet in post 142575 said:

As for the other question Clive raised...
"any other routes where passenger trains have non-station stops just to change token?"
There are a few others. Trains stop briefly at Midge Hall signal box to pick up the single line token to Rufford. This one is even stranger as there's no passing loop; the line from Farrington Curve Jn to Midge Hall was singled later than the rest of the route but the token arrangements were retained, so there's a transition from TCB to Token Working in the middle of a single line.

As tokens aren't exchanged on the move anymore, any loop where the box isn't on the platform will need a stop- trains to Maesteg stop at Tondu, then move up about 100m and stop at the box. I think Sellafield takes the record for this; even though the box is at the far end of the platform, trains still perform a double stop.

Thanks, though I was thinking of passing loops not associated with a station rather than the marginal cases that you mention (they are interesting, though). I didn't notice the Tondu one, probably because it was dark. As I say in the write-up, the most interesting one for me is Whitland, where the train stops before the station for the token to be collected by the driver who won't use it!

Whitland probably also beats Sellafield: an up train goes only two chains to reach the box (at least, my memory is that the train did move rather than the signaller came across to the station to collect the token).

Log in to reply
Where was I in July 2021? 29/11/2021 at 20:32 #142612
headshot119
Avatar
4243 posts
Online
Sellafield performs a double stop as the box steps and veranda for token exchanges is the north side of the box rather than the platform side.
"Passengers for New Lane, should be seated in the rear coach of the train " - Opinions are my own and not those of my employer
Log in to reply
Where was I in July 2021? 29/11/2021 at 21:55 #142616
SamTDS
Avatar
152 posts
I haven't had a look at the pictures for the quiz yet and probably would fail spectacularly, interestingly where I was in July (on my birthday too) was Treforest and Taffs Well doing my PTS. Id love to have the knowledge that so many of you posses.
SamTDS - STDS | My comments are my opinions and interpretations and do not reflect on the wonderfull SimSig team. I am in no way part of the team.
Log in to reply
Where was I in July 2021? 30/11/2021 at 14:22 #142635
Ron_J
Avatar
311 posts
Humorist in post 142539 said:
I think that CC tries to keep some of its drivers "route-learned" on the Sub, while ScotRail does not. Most of the time this doesn't matter, and didn't until a ScR train spread the track in West Princes Street Gardens some years ago. The ScR services had to be piloted by freight drivers, while CC were able to run most of theirs.

Just to correct this, some Edinburgh ScotRail drivers sign the Sub (just one link I think?) but I don’t think any of their conductors do.

Log in to reply
Where was I in July 2021? 30/11/2021 at 14:24 #142636
Ron_J
Avatar
311 posts
bill_gensheet in post 142575 said:

Keith Jn is remote from Keith (or has that gone now ?)
Keith loop is away from the station, yes, but Elgin - Keith and Keith - Huntly are ScR Tokenless sections.

Log in to reply
The following user said thank you: bill_gensheet